Coop in Tiberian Dawn.

[Brinestein]

I have been playing around with the Tiberian Dawn editor lately, i suddenly found that it was possible to create multiplayer missions. Although with a few bugs the ai works really well and the missions can actually be quite challenging. I can't believe nobody thought to implement coop in CnC before, anyway here is a few minutes of gameplay from the map i edited, it's one of the maps from the final mission of the GDI campaign.

C&C1/TD coop playtest (last GDI mission)
If i fix all the bugs on the map which include the obselisks not working for some reason (probably just needs some power plants), the ai resigning when their temple blows up and oddly enough, the enemy makes loads and loads of mcv's and mobile bases, i'll post it in the map section.
As i have said, other than those bugs, the ai works really well, they even tried a chinook tactic on me once which scared the hell out of me.

[Revolutionary]

Its an interesting idea, I take it they grays are neutrals?
This could well bring a compleatly new element to C&C and possibly even RA.

[Brinestein]

Its an interesting idea, I take it they grays are neutrals?
This could well bring a compleatly new element to C&C and possibly even RA.

The greys are NOD forces, the ones that you fight.

[MNdakota]

Off topic but, it seems that the only problem with C&C95 multiplayer seems to be the tiberium. It always runs out and it takes forever for the blossom tree to regrow it.

[Brinestein]

Off topic but, it seems that the only problem with C&C95 multiplayer seems to be the tiberium. It always runs out and it takes forever for the blossom tree to regrow it.

Well actually, we wasted alot of resources that game, if it is actually too much of a problem i could easily add more tiberium or blossom trees.

[Nyerguds]

the ai resigning when their temple blows up

How is that a bug? Losing all stuff is the only way a player can lose in MP. Heck, I'm surprised that actually works as result of a Win trigger... if that's how you did it anyway.

Its an interesting idea, I take it they grays are neutrals?
This could well bring a compleatly new element to C&C and possibly even RA.

The greys are NOD forces, the ones that you fight.

Yeah, the double colour exception doesn't work in multiplay, so Nod has no red buildings. Their real colour is grey; the buildings are in fact the exception

[Brinestein]

Well i only remembered now that the actual objective is to destroy Kanes temple, so it's not actually a bug, but i did intend for the player to have to destroy all nod buildings before winning, i'll just fortify the temple some more.

Also both players win once the temple is gone, which is very conveniant.

[Crimsonum]

Destroying the temple never ended the mission. You had to destroy every Nod unit and building.

[Brinestein]

I'll have to look into it then.

[Nyerguds]

wait, that's just the last GDI mission? Huh...

[ShadowDog]

I can't believe nobody thought to implement coop in CnC before

...

Well, good luck. Here's some info that may help you from a PM i had with Nyerguds.

[...]

Also, I'm trying out co-op and counter-op ideas. The co-op will rely on either 1. either you making changes so that allies work like in RA in multiplayer and any AI is counted as an enemy as long as it's not Neutral, 2. you adding a "Every Player Wins" trigger, or 3. the honor system. Or who knows, it might be fun to go "Okay, Nod's gone. VICTORY SLAUGHTER!"

I don't quite get what you mean, but I've never looked into the victory or loss conditions, even in single player... not to mention, 90% of all scripting for singleplayer missions fails in multiplayer. The AI builds whatever it wants, and always attacks the most northern target with its units. So far, everything related to creating teams fails. Reinforcing works though.

[...]

I'd just like to note that I had to take a look at VGMaps to realize GDI 1 and 2 took place on the same battlefield.

vgmaps? Who needs vgmaps for that?
http://nyerguds.arsaneus-design.com/cncstuff/mappics/

[...]

If I put Multi2 on a multiplayer map, then start it in Skirmish mode, will the second player AI assume control of any units/buildings/etc? I know that's sort of an obvious yes, but for all I know it would have 2 separate House Multi2s and make the game kill itself. Also, would an actual second player control these units? Also, if I give Multi1 a start point, could I give Multi2 some units and buildings and put it's spawn point off the map so it doesn't get an MCV?

Eh, I'd say... try it out? I'm not sure how the multi-teams are divided... all I know is that it's not because you choose red that you'll be multi6. The colours are given to players, not the other way around. So I guess that indeed, player 1 will be Multi1, player 2 Multi2 etc. So if you put some multi1 stuff on a map and start it in skirmish, you'll find out.

[...]

P.P.S. What are some of the coolest things you can pull off in multiplayer using triggers?

Well, it's possible to reinforce stuff for each side, but if you have constant extra reinforcements there should be a system to stop them after the player is declared Dead, so I thought of the Destroy Trigger functions for that. Unfortunately, there are only 3 destroyable triggers in C&C (XXXX, YYYY and ZZZZ), and 6 multi-sides. v1.06c fixes this, adding destroyable triggers UUUU, VVVV and WWWW.

[...]

[...]Are there any  door-to-door steak salesmen in Belgium?

Steak? lol, not at all.

[...]

Oh, and soon I'll be able to test out my stupid ideas in multiplayer and see just how much I'm screwing up. Would there be any way to watch and control the AI like that one program for TS or RA2 by VK that infamously let you control other players. Man, VK's a hoot for all the wrong reasons.

No, but I once changed the player side in a savegame so I controlled the AI side. That acted pretty weird, since it automatically fired superweapons (even the airstrike) and built stuff without me asking

Moving on, I have a few questions:

First, do you just find each other and hit 'A' on one of their units to ally in Command and Conquer? If not, how do you keep your units from shooting each other?

Second, is Nod side BadGuy in this mission? If so, have you tried using Nyergud's code to change the side's colors?

Third, do multiple AIs "gang up on the humans"?

Fourth, is there any way to keep your guys from blasting the Neutral units on sight?

[Nyerguds]

1. Yes, allying is just selecting a unit of a different player and pressing "a".

2. Yes, Nod is badguy, but as I already said, that secondary colour is disabled altogether in multiplay. It has always been like that, and I didn't change it. Also, the side recolouring logics I made are simply not used in multiplayer, as far as I know. I could enable them, but at the moment they aren't.

3. Yes, though I added a rules.ini option that disables this. Since AIs have the tendency to always attack the most northern unit or structure, this isn't too spectacular though, since they just murder eachother starting with the most northern player, until you are (or any of your co-players is) the most northern player.

4. Neutral? Not sure... I don't know if alliances are actually read from the ini in multiplay.

[Jeod]

So is it possible to make a coop campaign that you can select in multiplayer? (Not the individual maps, I mean like the dinosaur missions in the New Missions selector, with the maps being played in succession) Either way, I'd like to help you guys get all the missions out! It's been forever since I used the map editor though. Maybe you should write a tutorial on how to convert.

EDIT: I assume the same thing can be done for Red Alert?

[Nyerguds]

no, map succession is impossible in multiplay, for the simple reason that just the score screen delay would desync the game.

[Jeod]

But doesn't your 1.06c have an option to disable the score screen?